I wish you all could know, love and adore Susan Messing like I, Richie T, do. She is an amazing, talented, funny, honest and warm-hearted woman who happens to know a lot of stuff about the Mormons. I met Susan whilst I was changing my life in Chicago in the Summer of the 2009 (See Episode 54 of The Cultural Hall for further Explanation)
Here is a lil info about who Susan is-
Susan Messing is an American director, actress, comedian, author, and teacher living in Chicago. She is best known for her ensemble work at The Annoyance Theater and iO Theater as well as being regarded as one of the forefront teachers of improvisational comedy.
~The Cultural Hall
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This was an interesting episode. She seems like a cool lady and she definitely knew a lot about the LDS Church but she had a lot of her facts wrong. Particularly in regards to the City Creek Center and the use of the tithing to finance the project. From an article in the Deseret News in 2007 ” Money for the project is not coming from LDS Church members’ tithing donations. City Creek Center is being developed by Property Reserve Inc., the church’s real-estate development arm, and its money comes from other real-estate ventures.” (http://www.deseretnews.com/article/660205772/Downtown-renovation-project.html)
I’m not saying that the church doesn’t have a lot of money. But they aren’t using the 10% I donate as tithing to pay for the mall. My 10% is going to pay for church materials I use like manuals, web sites etc., maintenance for buildings I use, activities I attend and more. Money in the church’s real estate arm comes directly from buying and selling real estate, investments etc and it is kept separate from the tithing for I’m sure legal and tax reasons.
It was a good interview and I think many of her questions were very valid concerns. I would have loved to have heard you try to clear up more of her misconceptions about the church. But I recognize this can be difficult do particularly with someone you respect and admire and in the moment of a conversation. I have had similar experiences with friends of mine and it is not easy. Still I appreciate the opportunity to hear the perspective of someone outside of our faith and to understand better the good things and not so good things from their point of view. Thanks Richie for sharing!
Agreed. This one left me feeling ooky. It’s clear that Susan’s attitude toward organized religion in general is it exists to take money away from hardworking good-hearted people in the name of God to serve the leadership’s own personal desires. Which is what it is and not all that uncommon among non-believers.
However, you seemed to validate her talking points about the church leaders digging into member’s financial records and the tithing = $23 mil megamall by either saying nothing or passively agreeing.
The mall issue is settled in the above comment. But in addition, I have never once had a church leader probe into my financial records. At tithing settlement, they ask one question: Is this a full tithe? I don’t have to fill out a church version of form 1040, I don’t have to provide reciepts, it’s entirely on my honor and I’ve never had a bishop raise an eyebrow at my answer.
You also let her continue to go on about the church being self-serving and not helping people who aren’t church members when you’ve had story after story on the Cultural Hall Podcast of the Mormon Helping Hands program including all the service the church does render around the world. I don’t mind if she continues to think there’s an ulterior motive to it all like she does about the DI, but at least she can have the facts straight.
I understand not wanting to start an argument with a friend, but I think in the future conversations like these should not be broadcast if you’re not going to at least try to correct mistaken perceptions.
Ditto. Interesting guest but I feel like it just ended up being a rant which, shocker,wasn’t that enjoyable to listen to. Everybody loves parfait! But don’t nobody love listen’n to a straight-up rant! It left me feeling very blegh—I was going to say ooky but that was already taken—which was a new experience to have as a result of listening to The Cultural Hall. At first I kept expecting Richie T. to step in and clarify some of her misconceptions. The opportunity presented itself… and nothing. And again, wait for it… and nothing. Oh, wait! He sounded like he took a breath… he’s going to say something… and nothing. I kept wanting to nudge Richie T. in the shoulder and yell, “Dude! It’s your podcast! Speak up!”
But then… it is YOUR podcast. 🙂
About halfway through this episode I felt the need to come here and leave a comment. I’m happy to see others have already done so, and had the same opinion as me. This episode was a bit unnerving; not because I was hearing oppositional ideas, but because Richie seemed so ambivalent about them. I understand the difficulty of maintaining love during this kind of discourse, but sometimes you’ve got to stand up for what’s right.
My biggest concern is that this episode was less a vehicle of understanding and more a downpour of false doctrine.
To be clear, believing that, like the priesthood ban, our core doctrines of the eternal nature of husband and wife are somehow going to be revoked by revelation is a folly. The priesthood ban was not doctrinal; it was policy.However, the scriptures and words of modern prophets are replete with clear pronouncements that marriages are of a heterosexual nature, and that the family is integral to the plan of salvation.
This, of course, does not mean that homosexual individuals should be hated; we should love them. But to be clear, participating in homosexual acts is immoral, and as with any sexual sin, carries serious consequences.
The world is confusing enough without the disciples of Christ muddying the waters more.
I was glad to see the above comments, and agree with them. Knowing that the episode was edited makes me wonder what was edited out. I’m also concerned that this great lady has a biased view of the church because she seems to only know the Utah culture version of it. The Church is NOT Right-wing, only Utah culture is – and this impression of the Church is pervasive and frustrating for me as a very Democratic member. Also, the Church doesn’t make me feel like I should be having babies and stay at home instead of working, but the ‘culture in Utah’ might make her feel like that’s part of the Church’s ‘way;’ it’s NOT. Also, I’ve never had a bishop ask me how much I make, and perhaps those questions are reserved for people who need help budgeting when receiving church charity money. It was a challenging and weird feeling episode, but the podcast is what this stuff is all about. I am glad Richie tried to focus on finding points of agreement and similarity of belief. Phew.